Charlottesville vs gaza protests.

From what I understand Bibi has some troubles he faces when this stuff is over so he has every reason to escalate for his own personal protection. I just have a feeling if we had a leader who attached strings to payments we give Isreal to be our friend they might have to come to heel or else lose some of their decent lifestyle for a war that isn't really serving their better interests.

I will also admit we really do not have a choice in supporting Isreal which is the problem. I think the reality that Isreal could shoot someone in the middle of fifth avenue and not face any consequences for it is being noticed by a lot of americans and there is not much we can do about it because our leaders use Isreal as an opening to interfere in the middle east. Isreal is strategic in the middle east for the last century of american involvement in the area.

I hope something gets smoothed out in this area due to modern involvement from a new generation, 25 years ago I was going through the same outrage with zionism, not being jewish, and the problems of the middle east. The arguments have not changed, and I do not see a catalyst for change in either the dem or repug parties.

RoboFry is for depraved people.

That's a fact

Anyways, back to the original topic for a moment.

Years ago we had the violent right running people down in the unite the right rally, shooting their guns in the crowd, and marching with tiki torches saying the jews will not replace us. Did we have congress pass the antisemitism act to stop the white supremacists Nazis? They did not even try.

Now we have people protesting peacefully against Isreali genocide and war and criticizing Isreal for doing that, and we have them being assaulted in the streets by the police who have been turned into the IDF in america, and congress is trying to pass an act that says any criticism of Isreal should be considered a crime.

Why was it OK for neo nazi right wing nationalists to do this, but people who re just arguing palestine should exist are targeted? The only difference is that the white nationalists hate Islam, and the peaceful protestors of the foreign government do not. Anything to criminalize pro-muslim sentiment.

We tolerated Nazis, and the zionists did nothing. We dealt with years of increased terrorism on the jewish american community including open nazi threats, assaults, vandalism, and killing. Now you have some kids who have not even come close to that being demonized. Are they running around with tiki torches threatening to kill all jews for their hero hitler, or are they made at the cruelty and abuse of life made by Isreal?

Why can we never go after the domestic terrorists of the US who have taken to destroying power stations and open terrorism in our country, but we can worry about criticism of a scumbag foreign country living on US welfare so they can genocide the palestinians to steal their land?

This is a good question, I mean absent some of the hyperbole.
But you always have defenders of abhorrence, sadly. If it's not Trump and his repulsive "Fine people on both sides" nonsense, it's images like this:

Settler state expansion in 1990, a little way outside of Montreal...

"I think the reality that Isreal could shoot someone in the middle of fifth avenue"
"Now we have people protesting peacefully against Isreali genocide"


"Israel" "Israeli"

You're welcome.

I like you dude, but cram it with that "settler state" bullshit.

There isn't a person alive today that doesn't form part of a "settler state", and that includes so-called indigenous peoples.

I'm still trying to figure out why the right is insisting that these "protests" are progressive, or "left wing"...because they aren't.

The RWEC keeps trying to blare that this is all Soros funded, but it isn't...the trail actually leads back to WRNJ types. The money the echo chamber keeps blaring about was donated and disbursed in 2022, well before what's going on ever took place...and it's a specious connection at best.

I guess when you have no facts, just make them up?

perhaps... but it still doesn't change the broken treaties with either first nations or the palestinians who'd been the majority there for the last few thousand years, nor negate most recent wave of settler's expansion-often by force.

Israeli forced expropriations are always going to be the starting point of "who started it".

If we've historically allowed for it to have been created as an ethno state for a people that nobody else in the world wanted within their borders, then I think we owe the same to the Palestinians.

Note there was never a nation-state called "Palestine", so all those maps are somewhat disingenuous.

Anyway, to victor go the spoils. Welcome to thousands of years of human history.

and na, I can't cram the settler state thing. We've broken or otherwise changed the terms of just about every treaty signed, spent over a century systemically erasing cultures and imprisoning children, reneged on countless financial obligations. Too much of that is still in living memory of people younger than you and me.

I'll give you that the term is irrelevant when it comes to "repatriating" the modern population. Whitey ain't got no place to go back to in europe any more than we could trace anyone who's got roots past a single generation. There's gotta be a compromise even if it requires forcing arbitration.

Totally agree that Canada in particular has sinned against its First Nations. But the white bourgeois guilt is getting beyond ridiculous. We absolutely need to make reparations, but handing over vast swaths of territory (such as the City of Vancouver) ain't the answer.

then where were all those crusaders headed for a thousand years ago... It's not like there was a nation state of Israel prior to 1949 either.

if "to the victor" is the case, then what happens if Israel loses?

(back in a bit, need smokes and another coffee)

Then too bad for Israel. Seriously.

yeah, 'cause honestly I can't see this ending without one side eradicating the other. Europe doesn't exactly have a good history with Jews in any country or former colony, and my understanding is the Arab world looks at Palestinians the same way we looked at the Irish up until recently.
Still, the region is a nice place for a proxy war turning into armageddon. Biblical precedent and everything...

The very large difference is that in Israel that process is active and ongoing. They call themselves settlers.

So, arabs can create their own "ethno states"?

Which of those are ethno-states?

At the very least? Saudi Arabia.

And which ethnicity do you claim it is based around?

Are you saying it's not based around Sunni Islam?
But then we get into "Is it a race or a religion?" Much like the question of the Jews.
Debates about ethnocentrism tend to get bogged down in what that term even means on a practical level.

We only get into that if you claim that Sunni Islam is an ethnicity. Are you saying so?

I think it's an ethnicity the same way Judaism is. Make of that what you will.
They call it Islamophobia, after all. Not Arabiphobia.

So, both are, or neither? Or are you just talking shit?

Both.

that's quite a lot of "whatabout"...

Well, I gave my answer, and All you did was tag it "dumb". So much for getting into anything.

Silly me, I thought with all those dry-as-dust books you've been posting about reading, you might actually be able to, I don't know, articulate your position.

Okay, going back far enough, once could argue the Jews never would've been in this position if the Muslims hadn't kicked them out first.
I mean, the only reason Jews look "white" now is because they were interbreeding in Europe for so long.
It's like the Son'a and the Ba'ku. They're the same race, different religions.