This Just In . . .

The only thing Zimmerman was guilty of was being a dumbass. Unfortunately, his dumbassery contributed to getting another dumbass killed.

...and I thought he just called the non-emergency police number...not 911.

has a friend.

I have found that the lines are so sharply drawn on this issue that there is little room for clear thinking on either side.

It is clear that Zimmerman killed Martin. That is not in doubt.

There is no evidence, other than pure supposition, that racism had anything to do with it. There is enough evidence that it could indeed have been self-defense that there is no possible way an objective court could prove murder.

But none of that proves it was self-defense, either. There is no good way to get both sides of the story, and no good way to know how much of what Zimmerman says is pure fact and how much is what he wants to believe.

So those claiming it was self-defense are as wrong as those claiming it was murder. They are both confusing opinion with fact. Some have the opinion that Zimmerman was not justified in what he did; some have the opinion that he was. But very few are willing to say it is just an unprovable opinion.

The principle of law -- in a society founded on "innocent until proven guilty" -- means he is found "not guilty" of murder. That doesn't mean innocent. But it can mean innocent. And any firm conviction either way, lacking objective proof (which is not forthcoming here), is still just an opinion.

So go ahead and insult each other all you want, but that will not prove either side to be right.

My very firm opinion, personally, after unending arguments from both sides, is that I don't know and don't know how anyone can know. But I do agree that there is no way Zimmerman could be found guilty of murder, in a court of law (I'm not talking about a court of internet warriors), without that verdict doing much worse damage to our "justice" system than I want to imagine.

You assume the jurors know something different. Given what I have heard and seen it cannot be determined that zippy was not in danger from an altercation he instigated. Hence the not guilty verdict would be appropriate as per the law. However, that does not mean that is the way it happened in reality. You do need to keep up. Not guilty in court only means he got away with it, not that he did not do it.

Again, not having a case does not make him innocent of the crime. It just means you cannot prove it in a court of law and that the government will not act upon his guilt. Reality does not change simply because a court of law follows harsh rules. One also should note that it is on purpose that the rules should be stacked against the prosecution as per the idealized theory of american justice. That means that it is supposed to be hard to prove the truth, not that the truth does not exist.

This was a good try, but there is one person I clearly know more than, and that is you.

It's actually even more nuanced than that, and you're a smart guy so I'm sure you'd agree. Not only is it "innocent until proven guilty", but the state must prove its case "beyond a reasonable doubt".

With what little I know of the Zimmerman case, short of a confession or clear video footage of the incident, there's no way the state would be able to prove the case beyond a reasonable doubt.

Since you're sure I'd agree (and since you are right about that...), I didn't really have any choice about which button to hit, did I?

I like Greg Gutfeld's similar description (given toward the end of countless weeks of coverage, clearly being tired of the whole thing): "Two guys got into a fight and they both went too far." Substituting "idiots" for "guys" works for me too.

The neighborhood had been having burglaries, Zim was on the neighborhood watch, and it was basically his job to do just that.

a) Would you walk up to a strange kid at night and ask him what he's doing? Good luck with that. I wouldn't do it. That's the cops' job.
b) How would Zim approaching Trayvon and questioning him have resulted in any different outcome? Trayvon would probably have still been pissed off and started a fight, and Zim might still have felt the need to shoot him. The only end result is a different location. Everybody's complaining that Zim getting out of his car was the root cause, now you want him to also chase the kid down and grille him?

And that's not what he did.

Actually, from what I remember Zim was not officially on the neighborhood watch, he just decided he'd carry a gun around and pretend he was on the neighborhood watch.

My understanding of how Neighborhood Watch works, is that when someone sees what he or she considers to be suspicious activity and/or crime, the only thing they are supposed to do is observe and report. Not confront, or question.

^That's my understanding too. Which is what he was doing.

Well, if he'd had a megaphone, I suppose.

Exactly. His following fucknuttery afterward has nothing to do with that case and as Async said, a guilty verdict would have done more damage to the overall system than any one person is worth.

This is also the reason why that Casey Anthoney bitch got off: no one could establish a motive or anything beyond circumstancial evidence. But she at least had just enough sense to stay as far from the media's attention as possible afterward.

Yep.

And yep.

It seems that everyone thinks that Zimmerman got out of his car and chased Martin.

That isn't what happened.

Zimmerman was sitting in his car on the phone with the police, Martin circled his car,

and then Martin *ran away*. The recording of Zimmerman's police call makes this absolutely clear.

AFTER Martin ran off--evidenced by the sound of the door and the seatbelt annunciator--Zimmerman got out of his car and followed after Martin to see where he went so he could tell the police, but he quit running once the police advised that they "didn't need him to do that."

At this point, from Zimmerman's perspective, he has NO CHANCE of catching up to Martin. Martin is gone, running, and Zimmerman is walking. EVEN OUT OF HIS CAR, his expectation is not to catch up to Martin. And, indeed, he continues his conversation with the police. Zimmerman said he continued into the apartment complex to try to find the street number--again, it's absolutely clear from the recording of the call that this is what's going on:

When that call ended, Zimmerman and Martin were less than two minutes from their encounter. Martin has gone, Zimmerman has no idea where he's at, and Zimmerman does NOT follow Martin's presumed course. Zimmerman's claims about what he did in that two minutes have been analyzed again and again and have been found to be plausible and consistent. Martin--if he is running away from Zimmerman--should NOT meet Zimmerman in the center courtyard of that complex. But he CHOSE to confront Zimmerman--the call to the girl confirms it--and thus, HE initiated the encounter.

Of course, just confronting someone--whether it was Zimmerman or Martin doing the confronting--is not against the law. It comes down to who initiated the violence. And the evidence all points at Martin. Martin chose the confrontation, and Zimmerman is the one beaten (despite being armed).

Zimmerman was beaten in part because he was sucker punched when Martin came up behind him.
Classic thug move, nothing to see here. Martin thought he messed with a pussy, but things went south.
He messed with a bull and got the horns. This is (last time I checked) the US.
Expect people to be armed, or at least consider the fact that they might be if you attack them.
Don't like it? Buy your own gun if you feel the need to. Or better yet don't physically attack people.
Everybody wins! You weren't doing anything, Trayvon? Cool, so you won't be charged with a crime
and Zimmerman ends up looking like a paranoid fool. But now you are dead and Zimmerman walks
among us. Smooth move.

You're glad he's dead, aren't you?

Not glad at all. But I'm not shocked either. In Augusta kids his age get shot all the time for much less,
but it's black-on-black so you'll never hear about it. It's barely local news, let alone national/international.