If there's been a thread about this already, apologies, and feel free to merge 'em, but I finally got around to starting this and I've just gotten through S1. I think shootER mentioned watching it, and I'd really like his take on it, his being in the industry and all, but has anyone else seen it?
If Jeff Daniels wasn't the lead, I wouldn't like the show as much as I do. He's always been one of my favorite actors and that buys the show more...tolerance...than I might otherwise give it. I like him and I like his character, but I find most of the other characters annoying or downright unlikeable (Charlie and the producer who was in love with the neurotic blonde girl--hate her, BTW--being the other two that I like). As much as I like Sorkin's work, the show tends to get very preachy at times, much more than than The West Wing ever did. Sorkin's "voice" is so evident that, at times, it sounds like Jed Bartlett is anchoring a newscast. Even when I find myself agreeing with what Will is saying, sometimes it's just too much. Technically speaking, I think most of the characters are far too young to have the jobs they have (even at a cable news network). Yeah, yeah, all the experienced staff left after the events in the pilot episode, but I find it very hard to believe that they'd permanently promote all the interns. I'm disappointed that there aren't any camera guys featured, even as bit players. A real missed opportunity on Sorkin's part because we have the best stories to tell. Along those lines, I also find it extremely hard to believe that in a heavily unionized town like New York City, that you'd have producers operating cameras in the field. Same thing with editing. There was a "don't report me to the union steward" line in a first season episode when one of the producers edited something in a pinch, but last season the neurotic blonde girl edited a sound bite--and botched it. Speaking of: Overall I like the series, but I liked Season 1 better than Season 2. I'm also curious about where they'll go next year. This season's finale seemed to wrap up all the plotlines. I read somewhere that Sorkin wrote it that way because it wasn't clear that the series was going to get renewed (it did--HBO kinda had to once Daniels won the Best Actor Emmy) and he didn't want viewers wondering about the loose ends. It's one thing when you do that on a definitely cancelled show like Sports Night, but what's next, though? Their newsroom uses Avid iNews on their desktops. I know because I recognized the breaking news beeps in the first episode and recognize the interface from our computers at the office (though we're switching to a different program early next year). When Jim(?) is covering the Romney campaign and shooting his own stuff where he appears on camera (called a "stand up"), he's holding a microphone with a wireless transmitter on it, but there's no corresponding receiver on the camera (no antennas visible at all).
*Mocking teenage girl voice* Yooouuu watch shoooows by Aaaaron Soooooorkiiiin??!!?!? EEEEEEWWWWW!!!!!
I love the show, but I honestly can't stand it when Mackemzie talks because between her accent and Sorkin's rapid-fire dialogue, I can't understand half the stuff she says, and have to rewind and repeat several times just to keep up.
I just realize you hadn't seen Season 2 yet. Please don't click on the spoiler tag in my post unless you want to really be spoiled. I gave away just about the whole season. What's your take on what you've seen so far?
Ehhhh.....how long does it take to get good? Rough episode count estimate. I'll watch that many. If it doesn't grab me by then....
IMHO, the first season is pretty solid but the show really starts to get good in Season 2. The quality dropped off quite a bit after Sorkin left, though (after Season 4? 5? I forget when).
Suggestion? Turn on the closed captioning, at least until you get used to the rapid-fire delivery. There's so much texture to the dialogue - and often a lot of cross-talk - that you won't want to miss a single one-liner. (There's also a site that has most of the scripts, if you're interested.)
I was prepared for it thanks to watching both seasons of Sports Night before being turned on to The West Wing by a coworker (he loaned me his VHS recordings of the first season so I could get caught up over the summer between S1 and S2). The Newsroom seems to have ramped it up even more. Diacanu, you'll love the pilot if, for no other reason, than the part where the fundie Christians get put in their place. That happens more than once in the series.
No worries. I stopped reading your post when I got to the spoiler tag. Wasn't sure how much of what followed I might or might not want to know. I almost quit with the pilot, because Will's character is sooo abrasive I thought, Really? There are antiheroes and there are assholes, and do I really want to watch a show where the lead is an asshole? But I gave it a second episode and he softened up, and now I like him a lot. So, yeah, enjoying it quite a bit. The dialogue, of course. The clever use of Real Life events woven through the fiction. The love triangle/quadrangle/whatever-the-hell...not so much. Because obviously Maggie is Donna Moss redux, and we pretty much know who's going to pair off with whom eventually. I've seen just enough so far to appreciate the Easter eggs (not least of which is the fact that the actor playing Jim is the actor who played Tyler, the doofy kid driving them to the train station in "20 Hours in America"). Yeah, I notice things like that. And Sam Waterston, obviously having the time of his fucking life. As Josh Lyman would say, "Holy Mother of God!" Sam fucking Waterston. Did I mention Sam Waterston? More when I've finished S2.
OMG, yes! Mary Marsh...I know that bitch and all her sisters! I can watch that scene over and over...
You can read all the stuff after my spoiler. The only thing I really give away is a general plot point regarding Jim and a vague "summary" of the season finale. It's been so long since I watched The West Wing that I didn't realize he was the kid from that WW episode. And I notice stuff like that, too (I generally watch teevee with a laptop on my lap so I can look up that kind of stuff on IMDB). I'm about caught up with all the current shows I watch. I may rerun TWW over my holiday break, if not before then. I'll be curious to see if any of Sorkin's "regulars" show up. Josh Molina (Sports Night, The West Wing), Felicity Huffman (Sports Night, The West Wing), Janel Maloney (Sports Night, The West Wing), Timothy Busfield (The West Wing, Studio 60). Not to mention Bradley Whitford and Matthew Perry.
This comes closest to "guilty pleasure" viewing for me among current shows. The hour's usually enjoyable popcorn, but as soon as I stop to think about it, it's really extremely clumsy ideological propaganda. It cheats and twists at every turn, pretending to discuss politics and even make points in some assumed political debate, but never ever does. It's fine that the show won't cover politics; but it's trying to pretend it does and sell this as one of its main draws, and that really sucks. Also, while a lot of the old Sorkin magic is still there, a lot of it is indeed old -- some scenes seem copied, line by line, from early WW/Studio stuff, and some of the other things have become sloppy and tired. The way he completely overturned the main plot point of season one in season two, wholly redefining two recurring characters, should be a hanging offense.
My wife and I are just finishing up with a West Wing rewatch -- the Santos-Vinick election is a few episodes away. This looks like it could be a good item for next on the list.
Why, oh, why did they have to change the theme music in S2? I liked the theme music, dammit! Liked the S1 intro as well, but I can see why they abandoned that. But now that I've got the original theme in my head, they've swapped it out for some jittery electronic remix.
As a Brit, you are used to the accent, so it's likely a non-starter for you. Us 'merkins ain't so used to it.
I've gotten into the the habit of using closed captioning for some shows, starting with Katee Sackhoff’s lock-jawed delivery on BSG. Nothing wrong with my hearing; I’d just like to understand what they’re mumbling. And almost always for British shows based anywhere north of London.
All the critical reviews of the show I've read have said more-or-less this. The fans of the show who are so over-the-top about it, who yap on-and-on about the show being politically insightful, turn the show from a guilty-pleasure into a no-watch for me. If I watched it I'd end up talking about the show with people who'd make me want to slug them; friendships would end. The fans of the show often remind me of Obama supporters during the 2008 primary election cycle: they take the prosaic and ascribe to it magic.
This for me, pretty much. I watch the show because it's mildly entertaining and because of inside baseball stuff (and because it runs in the summer, when there's not much else on that interests me). It's nowhere near as good as The West Wing, but to hear some people talk you'd think it was even better. The guy who reviews the show for Esquire does a bang up job, IMHO. His takes usually reflect my own.
Random observations at the start of S2: Yeah, okay, the opening theme isn’t all that bad. I’ve adjusted, especially since they’ve gone back to playing the original to accompany the closing credits. I mean, I love Roger Daltrey as much as the next person, but…(and for the record, one of the MAJOR gripes I had with TWW was the hyper-chipper closing-credits theme). So there’s that. It would have been very helpful if they’d give us a date at the start of “…Let’s Kill All the Lawyers.” They provide dates in lots of other instances (even in the ep title “5/1”), but this seems to be the one place where it would be absolutely essential. Yes, we have Marcia Gay Harden’s line about “14 months ago,” but since this is the first ep of a new season, the impression is “Oh, okay, they’ve skipped a year and change” not “The entire second season is a flashback.” So that made me And, true, it’s no West Wing. So far – and I’m still at the start of S2 – I’d have to say The Newsroom : The West Wing :: DS9 : Classic Trek. There can be only one. That said, IMO, Sloan is Sam Seaborn, even if the initials didn’t give it away. Will is obviously Bartlet, but with just enough ADHD Drama Queen to be a little bit Josh Lyman as well (thank the gods Jim isn’t another Josh!), Sam is Leo McGarry, and Maggie is turning out to be Donna Moss’s Evil Twin. Not sure who Mack is - maybe a little bit late-season C.J.? TBC…
Just last night I started watching TWW again from the pilot and my wife commented on how much she hated that "happy" opening music. I agreed, but reminded her that they only used the hyper-chipper music as the opening theme for the first episode (it starts with the overhead shot of Leo walking into the White House--the only episode, IIRC, where the opening credits rolled over actual scenes and not the open with the flag and stuff). The "real" opening them for TWW is one of my favorites. I can't believe I didn't tumble to the Sloan/Sam connection. Mac is a combination of Abbey Bartlett and Lord John Marbury.
Mine, too. It was the end credits theme that bugged me. They had the good sense not to use it for some of the more serious episodes and, interestingly, I can’t find a clip on YouTube, so I’m guessing it’s not too popular. TWW is still some of the finest television ever made in this country. It’s okay. I watched House for years and never caught on to the Sherlock Holmes thing. I’m waiting for Sloan to say “I’m…going back to my office now.”
She's very smart and good at what she does and drives the man who loves her crazy. Plus she's wacky and British.
From last night's viewing: "witless bullies and hapless punks" - there's a descriptor that's going into my permanent lexicon.
