2024 General Election Thread

Discussion in 'The Red Room' started by shootER, Mar 28, 2024.

  1. Diacanu

    Diacanu Comicmike. Writer

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  2. Crosis36

    Crosis36 Author

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  3. RickDeckard

    RickDeckard Socialist

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    Nonsense. Civil wars are such that the protagonists are often feted by their supporters long after they've been defeated. You'll find this in England, Ireland, China, Spain and elsewhere in various forms.
    The Confederates are more the rule than the exception.
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  4. Crosis36

    Crosis36 Author

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    Supporters is one thing. Do those governments name schools after leaders of failed revolutions? Do they build monuments to generals that rose up in arms against them?
    I've never seen an example of that, but if I'm wrong I'd love to know.
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  5. RickDeckard

    RickDeckard Socialist

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    The monarchy lost the English Civil War and have more than just monuments dedicated to them. The losing side in the Irish Civil War dominated our politics for most of the 20th century - there are monuments for those people. The winners of the Spanish civil war are the ones most detested there and there's a debate about removing their monuments. (The losers ones are mostly uncontroversial.)
    The divisions that motivate civil wars rarely disappear after the fighting stops. Where you find exceptions they tend to be totalitarian states.
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  6. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    “Those who control the present, control the past and those who control the past control the future.” This is the goal of the left, this is why they’re hell bent on destroying our history. They want to rewrite it in their name so they can control future generations.
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  7. tafkats

    tafkats scream not working because space make deaf Moderator

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    Jesus Christ.

    For the millionth time, ceasing to celebrate evil is not the same as destroying history.

    Or do you think that these photos depict horrible travesties perpetrated by people bent on rewriting history and controlling future generations?

    StalinStatue.jpg

    SaddamStatue.jpeg
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  8. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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  9. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    It’s like every morning you get the DNC talking points memo and are told to repeat them.
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  10. Jenee

    Jenee Driver 8

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    ?
    !
    ?
    Where’s that irony meter icon?
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  11. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    It’s right there.
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  12. Crosis36

    Crosis36 Author

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    It says something that you would revere the people fighting to keep slavery intact.
    Dress it up however you want, but that's what they were fighting for. That's why they seceded. Any other issues are ancillary.
    Hitler was actually a good artist, but I wouldn't hang his paintings on my wall.
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  13. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    I don’t revere them, though I think Lee and Stonewall Jackson were good tacticians. You don’t get to dictate what they were fighting for when we have what they were fighting for in their own words.
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  14. Jenee

    Jenee Driver 8

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    So, you just accept that what they are saying is their true feelings?
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  15. Crosis36

    Crosis36 Author

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    England is a bit different, since Cromwell WON, and actually instituted lasting changes in British government as head of state. Even as such, monuments to him are pretty controversial in England, ESPECIALLY with the Irish and the monarchy.
    I'd argue that the Irish Civil War isn't actually resolved, considering the existed of Northern Ireland and the origins of its main political parties.
    As for Spain, the winner became the loser after Franco died and the monarchy / republic was restored. And while some of them still revere those "glory days", it is now literally illegal to exalt or commemorate Franco.
    The divisions rarely disappear, yes, but I've not seen a country that has ever revered a loser that never held power.
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  16. Crosis36

    Crosis36 Author

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    It doesn't matter what they said.
    What they did is what counts. They fought to defend a regime that enforced slavery, rape, and torture.
    Everything else is just prevaricating to avoid that uncomfortable truth.

    Again, Hitler was a great tactician (until he wasn't). Not Gonna build a monument to his "military prowess" in Berlin.
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  17. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    I guess I could try an Ouija board.:rolleyes:
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  18. Jenee

    Jenee Driver 8

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    I’m just wondering what your criteria is for taking someone at their word.

    You take trump at his word, but not Biden
    You take MTG at her word but not AOC.

    What is it in a person’s speech or body language that says ‘this one’ is telling the truth, but ‘that one’ is lying?
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  19. tafkats

    tafkats scream not working because space make deaf Moderator

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    I don't need a memo to know that monuments to totalitarian regimes that oppress their people are often torn down when those regimes are overthrown.

    I only need a working knowledge of history.

    You know, that thing you supposedly studied.

    In the case of Saddam's statue, everyone in my generation — a group that I believe includes you — remembers that moment. Aside from Saddam's capture and death, it's probably the most iconic image of the entire war. (Well, that and Bush on the flight deck with the "Mission Accomplished" sign.)

    So, do those photos depict horrible travesties perpetrated by people bent on rewriting history and controlling future generations?
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  20. matthunter

    matthunter Ice Bear

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    If you can ever get it to stop saying "Disappointed" over and over.
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  21. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    I don’t believe I’ve said that I don’t believe AOC and I don’t think I’ve said I believe everything Trump says. As for Biden, he’s a known liar who has been fact checked to his face and still continues to lie.
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  22. Crosis36

    Crosis36 Author

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    So...just like every other politician ever?
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  23. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    You often need a reminder that the Democratic Party is the party that started the civil war, the party of slavery, the party of the Klan, the party that was against the civil rights movement and now the party of Marxists.
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  24. Crosis36

    Crosis36 Author

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    And when the Democrats moved away from that and embraced civil rights the Republicans swooped in to replace them.
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  25. Diacanu

    Diacanu Comicmike. Writer

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    Well! I guess I'd better vote for the toxic narcissist, rapist, crook, and traitor!
    :soma:
    :discuss:
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  26. Diacanu

    Diacanu Comicmike. Writer

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    He keeps being told this, and he hits the "reset" button anyway.
    He's not one to let facts get in the way of "owning the libs".
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  27. RickDeckard

    RickDeckard Socialist

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    You weren't talking about Cromwell. You referred to the losing side. That was the monarchy. They later got re-instated albeit with their absolutism restricted. And have many monuments, to say the least.

    The establishment of Northern Ireland was not a principle reason for the Irish Civil War, despite what some might claim. The main reason was the status of Ireland as a dominion of the British Empire. That has been resolved. And there are all kinds of statues and other things in all kinds of places to remember people who fought on both sides.

    Hence, once again, the actual loser in the war has lots of monuments.

    A significant qualification of your original statement. But there are exceptions to that too. Russia has monuments commemorating Kornilov. Germany has some of Rosa Luxemborg and Karl Liebknecht. Yes, the American situation has its quirks. But they all do. It's not some wild divergence from the rest of the world.
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  28. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    It was Democrat governors who stood in front of schools to block black students, not Republicans.
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  29. Steal Your Face

    Steal Your Face Anti-Federalist

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    Cowpens, SC. There’s a monument to fallen British soldiers who died during the Revolutionary War. There’s also one in Connecticut.
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  30. Damar

    Damar Liberal Elitist

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    Political realignment. Are you a history major?
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