We don't do reruns except for old T.V shows. Which is all this is. Had Russia worked to release factual info that cost Trump the election the lefties would have the usual attitude of "nothing to see here." There is no constitutional crises by any stretch of the imagination as no laws were broken and the election wasn't tampered with. Sorry, but Trump will be the next President regardless of whether liberals will accept it or not.
Well, chalk that up as another thing you got wrong. A liking or respect for the people of a country does not necessarily equate to similar feelings toward the government. The current Russian government does not have many mutual interests with the United States. That was true before the election, that remains true after the election. Many people in Russia are good, hard working people, worthy of our respect and concern. That was true before the election, it remains true after the election. It is also true regardless of whether they suffer under a brutal dictatorship.
From a policy standpoint, Pence is significantly worse in my opinion. Nevertheless, I would much rather have him as President, either via EC or impeachment, as it would be a step in cleaning up the mess we have on our hands.
Name calling again. Typical. And everything I've read is that Putin and his regime is very popular among the Russian people. So much for the Russian "people"
Not as popular as the Supreme Leader of North Korea is with his, according to everything we read. Unless, you know, we start reading and listening to other sources than the state propaganda.
You're thinking too small. Actively influencing the vote is a reason for war. Probably not happening with two nuclear superpowers but if Russian involvement is proven, prepare for economic sanctions like the world has never seen before.
From the top of my head: nepotism, cronyism, acting under the influence of a foreign power (if proven). And that's even before he has any real power...
You're forgetting that Putin's boy is about to occupy the Oval Office. I don't see any retaliation as long as that is true.
Not impeachable offenses. An unwritten rule since the Nixon impeachment has been that a president has to 1) Commit a clear crime 2) For clear cut political or personal gain.
If a Russian connection is found & proven, he'll be impeached before the new gold plated furniture arrives.
Like I've said, I loathe Trump and impeaching him and putting Pence in office would be great in my opinion. But that said, what has Trump actually done to merit impeachment?
You have more faith in our Congress than I do if you expect that to happen quickly. It could, and likely should, but the truth is they will spend a lot of time on investigations with no shortage of political gamesmanship. If he is impeached for this, it will probably take 18 months. In the mean time, Putin has his useful idiot.
I agree with gul that that isn't going to happen quickly, if at all. Furthermore, for it to happen, it would be necessary to prove not just that the Russians interfered by making known things that Hillary would rather have kept confidential, but that Donald Trump was personally instrumental either in inciting them to do it, or in implementing it. As much as I loathe Trump, I am not convinced that he did either.
We don't do re-run elections. There are some issues here though that still need to be talked about. First is how far the Russians went. If the Russians only went as far as using Wikileaks then there is no basis for a re-run. All countries try to influence elections. (look at all the foreigners who donated to Hillary's "charity" over the years) It's a lie to say otherwise. What the Democrats need to do in this case is to just beat on that drum for four years and find someone whose good enough to win in 2020. Second, if the Russians actively hacked and interfered with the election it needs to be shown and proven. If that can happen before the electoral college meets then they can simply vote for someone else. It doesn't have to be Hillary though there would be very strong pressure to make it her. If it happens after Trump is President-elect or sworn in then we have a bigger problem. Trump and Pence would have to go but neither would want to which means they'd have to be impeached but that might be impossible unless you can show that Trump and/or Pence knew about the Russians hacking. “No Title of Nobility shall be granted by the United States: And no Person holding any Office of Profit or Trust under them, shall, without the Consent of the Congress, accept of any present, Emolument, Office, or Title, of any kind whatever, from any King, Prince, or foreign State.” Except when it's Hillary Clinton and then it's okay. Short of the Russians being proven to hack the elections you'd have to show that Trump knew the Russians were helping him. And I mean knew as in you've got phone calls and messages going back and forth showing cooperation between Trump's campaign and the Russians.
Not the basis for the emoluments issue. It has to do instead with him using the office to benefit his business operations. He is already doing this.
Agreed on all counts. I was thinking I had slipped into another reality there, or was completely misunderstanding US law. -- But I think @gul meant the recent business deals with the emolument issue.
Well in that case then you still fail because you're using the wrong part of the Constitution. “No Title of Nobility shall be granted by the United States: And no Person holding any Office of Profit or Trust under them, shall, without the Consent of the Congress, accept of any present, Emolument, Office, or Title, of any kind whatever, from any King, Prince, or foreign State.” If you can't show his businesses are benefiting from any King, Prince, or foreign State than you have no case. If you're going to impeach him you just need to apply the old standard, "The President, Vice President, and all civil Officers of the United States shall be removed from Office on Impeachment for, and conviction of, Treason, Bribery, or other High Crimes and Misdemeanors." Concentrate on High Crimes and Misdemeanors part.
Oh and I just realized...... If one is going to make the case the Russians influenced the election than they influenced more then Trumps campaign. All the Republicans benefited as well. And if the Russians hacked then every election in the country is now suspect. A major clusterfuck.
You are misreading the clause, which totally doesn't surprise me. If he benefits as holds of the office from a contract or regulatory ruling in foreign country, that can very much be considered a gift. As for high crimes and misdemeanors, Congress so devalued the meaning of that during the Clinton impeachment, that pretty much anything can be applied to that lens.
You could apply that standard to anyone. Even Clinton and her charity if she had won. You could apply that standard to every House member and every Senator. You're going to far and looking for an easy out but it won't work. Unless you can show he's the one making deals to get those things your argument fails. No they didn't. They failed to remove Clinton. That doesn't mean it won't work on Trump who I think could easily walk himself into a impeachment.
Now all that remains is for him to create a Violet Room, and we stand back and watch as the people revolt. All too easy.
I don't know. I do know it's a relatively drawn out process. But then, in case there is bulletproof evidence on the table, what's to investigate. In that case, the GOP can positively not afford to not go along with an impeachment. Protecting their boy (whom most of them hate anyway) when it's clear he's guilty of what could amount to high treason? Yea, the two party system will be Dems and Greens come 2018 Anyway, I don't think there is a direct connection to Russia. There's a mysteriously high number of important Trumpists with very good connections, though. And if the shit hits the fan, one of them is crucified while Trump has plausible deniability.
To try and impeach Trump for something like this allegation even if true would open a huge can of worms. In the future, if another country wanted to discredit a person they did not want to be president they could simply "leak" information that they had secretly supported him or her.
