Israel is Coming Apart at the Seams, It Seems

I know Trump is non-stop bluster and hyperbole, but there is a part of me that says absolutely go take over Gaza. Of all the things he lies to us about, it would be hilarious if that was the one thing he followed through on.

Thoughts on Trumps meeting with fugitive war criminal Benjamin Netanyahu yesterday and his advocacy of forced displacement...

The destruction of Gaza made an attempt at something like this inevitable, although Trump is as usual saying all of the quiet parts out loud.
It's probable that a significant portion of the population of Gaza would accept the offer with little incentive given their situation. But many will not, and what then? And who is going to take them, given the unequivocal rejection of the idea from all quarters?

The numbers that Trump uses (1.7 - 1.8 million) are also striking, suggesting that Gaza has lost half a million people already - either murdered by the IDF or fled when the crossings were open.

It remains to be seen what will happen in the immediate future with the ceasefire. Netanyahu is visibly chomping at the bit to resume the killing. (Even as things deteriorate further in the West Bank, he continues to violate his agreement in Lebanon and a de facto annexation happens in Syria.)

Well, I guess I shouldn't be surprised that Trump looks at the ruins in Gaza and thinks "Hell of a place for a hotel."

wow, the hate drips from this like acid. what a miserable existence this must be

It occured to me this morning that moving them to the West Bank would make the most sense, but since Netanyahu seems determined to annex the whole of that too (just more slowly), Trump needs to find some sketchbag country willing to take them.

El Salvador is probably negotiating a price as we speak.

https://www.reuters.com/world/middl...taking-over-gaza-are-could-ignite-2025-02-05/

So Trump has managed to be a uniter, finally.
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Russia, China, Saudi Arabia, Germany,UK, Ireland, France, Spain, Iran, Jordan, Egypt, Turkey, Brazil, and Australia have all condemned the plan. When was the last time all of those nations agreed on something?
Netanyahu, meanwhile, praised Trump for thinking of new ideas.
Some choice quotes from Palestinians in Gaza:
"Trump can go to hell, with his ideas, with his money, and with his beliefs. We are going nowhere. We are not some of his assets," said Samir Abu Basel in Gaza City.

"He spoke with much arrogance...he can test us, and soon he will find out his fantasies don't work with us," said Gaza City resident Abu Basel.

"We will not leave our areas," said Um Tamer Jamal, a 65-year-old mother of six. "We have brought our kids up teaching them that they can't leave their home and they can't allow a second Nakba."

And Israeli politicians are already licking their chops:

Yep. This is gonna end well.

Wow. A commie giving Trump credit for a ceasefire Biden negotiated and got in place.

Horseshoe Theory is real.

I said a bunch of mean stuff about Bonzie when I left TrekBBS.
Then I took it back out of guilt a couple years later.
Yeah, I take back the take back.

Greeted as Liberators
What could go wrong?

Curious if this changes the thinking of whether it made sense to not vote Harris over Gaza. I thought that it was clear that whatever one might think of Biden/Harris on this issue, Trump was as bad and probably worse. And here he is, advocating some light ethnic cleansing on top of the situation. I think he literally talked about the area being cleaned up.

Are we still going to go with it was the argument that the brilliance/toughness of the Trump negotiators caused the ceasefire whereas the wimpiness of the Biden administration allowed the killing to continue?

No takebacksies x infinity!

"fugitive war criminal Netenyahu"

I find this relentless focus on justifying Joe Biden to be extremely disturbing. It's like trying to defend Goering on the assertion that he's not worse than Himmler. It barely fucking matters, even if it were true. There's no attempt at reckoning with the gravity of the crimes involved.

What we are "going with" is the messy reality. Trump forced a ceasefire by exerting pressure, something that Biden never did. The genocide has now stopped (or paused), yet there are other ongoing war crimes and efforts at Israeli expansionism, to which Trump has now proposed to add a further round of ethnic cleansing.

I don't have a crystal ball. If he tries to implement these plans and ends up violently removing everyone, killing tens of thousands of children in the process - then yeah, maybe we can have a conversation about how he's been worse than Biden. But it's a high bar and it doesn't change the fact that Biden (and Harris) could and should have changed their position.

How else would you describe the man who's openly endorsing the forced relocating of an entire ethnic group after bombing their homes to rubble?

Never happen. I can see a McDonald's Play Place, though.

You're straw-manning my argument and ad hominening in a big way.

You have not seen one word from me saying Biden has done a good job re: Israel/Palestine. Only that there was no reason to believe Trump was going to be any better than him when it came to treatment of the Palestinians and plenty of reasons to believe he would be even more pro-Israel.

My comments were primarily about how I can't understand how people could justify not voting Harris knowing a) that Trump was as bad as him on Israel or worse and b) even if we were just going to accept for argument's sake that Trump was somehow just the same, he was worse on so many other fronts.

Lo and behold, within two weeks of his taking office, Trump proposes making 1.5-2 million Palestinians refugees and the U.S. taking ownership of Gaza.

Who could have predicted that Trump wasn't a genius who brought about the ceasefire through force of will that Biden lacked? Oh right, pretty much anyone.
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He's said a lot of other stupid shit as well. The problem is that saying things and doing them are not equivalent, and you seem to care more about the former.

Joe Biden actually did supply the weapons to incinerate kids. He actually did pull out all of the stops to shield Israel diplomatically and economically from any consequences. He actually did preside over a government that covered up the evidence of enforced starvation.

But he says he wanted a ceasefire, and had a slick PR operation. Whereas Trump just vomits out whatever he wants, and may or may not follow through.

Correct, since neither "force of will" nor "genius" were offered as an explanation. Rather, Israel is a US client state, and it does what it is told.

I'd describe him as a target of anti-semitism.

As for the people of Gaza, they've had every opportunity to get out of harms way and were warned through multiple means.

Hamas cannot remain, otherwise this will never end. Leveling the area was for the protection of Israel, who didn't start this war.

https://www.post-gazette.com/news/p...donald-trump-gaza-israel/stories/202502040148

Wow. This slob really turned into a complete piece of shit, didn't he?

This dude was a con-man all along. Sometimes the left fails to see it coming too. But he was always about taking the money.

Biden couldn't negotiate his ice cream flavor. Just stop.

You know, I've been thinking long and hard about what I should respond to this with, or if I should even respond at all. How many hours over the decades have I wasted arguing with a TrekBBS staffer? All conversations that went nowhere.

So here's what I'm going to say...

Bonnie, I truly don't believe you're this person. Gaza is mostly filled with women and children. Before the "war," 47% of Gaza's population was under 18. Half the population were kids. 95% of those kids attended school, most graduated from High School, and 57% of the students at the Islamic University of Gaza were female. There were also close to 3,000 Christians living in Gaza. These aren't terrorist monsters. This is an innocent civilian population. If you could just allow yourself for one second to see these people AS people then maybe your perspective might change.

Not surprised at the utter lack of ideas coming out of the Arab American population, especially in and around Dearborn. Just constant finger pointing and blame for everyone except the actual belligerents. It’s Biden’s fault! It’s Harris’s fault! It’s Trump’s fault! It’s AIPAC’s fault! It’s the Democrats fault!

Or the Middle East in general

I must have missed all of the armed men around the Israeli hostages, especially the female soldiers, eh, Parallaxis? Even though they were being released, the women looked terrified.

Of course I'm not keen on kiddies and innocent women being hurt. But Palestinians truly belong in Jordan. And again, why won't their fellow co-religionists take them in? Because Palestinians are *Trouble* with a capital T. Both Jordan and Egypt and stable and wish to remain that way.

This problem began before we were born and no doubt will continue after we're dead. Israel has to deal with a people who don't ever want to cooperate with them, but want to destroy them, as Oct 17 showed. If Israel gives them a state, they're fools.

But, hey, not my call.

As for those who dislike/hate me, I guess I'll have to look for my hanky. Boo the fucking hoo. Don't care, never did, or I'd have never lasted online, ya know? There are always going to be those who don't like me, and I've never wasted my energy worrying about them. I value the good people online. The enemies just amuse me, except for the really, really stupid ones, and God knows they abound online.

That's a whole lot of words to just say you're one of the idiots who would have been cheering at a 1930s rally in Berlin.

And for those who find the parallels impossible to see:

The open question still stands to be answered, for those who think that ethnic cleansing is the ultimate solution here, can you please provide the other historical cases where you think ethnic cleansing campaigns were also the right thing.

You see though this is different, because the lesson from WWII is just that the Germans were all inherently evil, and not that they were a politically and morally diverse population like most of ours today who were rallied around a dictator by small seemingly reasonable (if extreme) steps none of which individually were clearly the outright turn to moustache twirling evil.

you seem so ideologically rigid that you should not make any sudden moves as it might cause you to break into pieces